And her book The Unconscious Origins of Certainty → Produce Your Podcast! You shouldn't aspire to have anybody else's life. Very formal. you should always ask your friends before you post pictures of their children on the Internet. Ann: One of my very oldest and dearest friends Lara Shipley is an assistant professor of photography at Michigan State University and she and I had a lot of conversations when she first started teaching the basically like photo 101 class there because in the past I think it was a class where people would learn how to like develop stuff in the dark room or maybe learn the rule of thirds in composing a photo. And I think that's very, very, very important. 10 Best episodes of Call Your Girlfriend Podcast. There were a couple of people who followed you. They're all photographs. [Laughter]. This is what I try to do, because I'm just like everyone else, I look at a photograph and I think oh, this is that thing. Ann: Could have been edited in the most unfair, unflattering way but also, you know, is one of those things that is actually a scene that stuck out to me more than the iconic cheese sandwich from Fyre Festival. Poet, artist and activist Cleo Wade feels deeply and writes movingly about growing up, finding ourselves, and having good boundaries with the people in our lives and our social feeds. And I'm like do you want to be here? Lara: They're completely highly sophisticated in their use of the medium. It did not go well. Like we are all laughing about it but this wild. Because if you think about a lot of things that went wrong in the 2016 election and the way that Russian bots are just going around fucking with our elections left and right I'm like this is the same extinct, it's the same kind of social engineering, and we're all part of that ecosystem. Ann: Okay what do you really want to talk about this week? And I know it sounds like smallest violin -- like first-world smallest violins but it actually isn't. Yeah, I mean John Berger, brilliant. Aminatou: Yeah, the other other McFarland. I enjoy . As we emerge back into the world, how long will we live with COVID? The place where I feel usually the most conflicted is how I share about not me on the Internet, you know what I mean? What's that one in upstate New York? Photographers can't be authors, right? [Laughs] My life is a mess." Bike racks, you know? Our theme song is by Robyn, original music is composed by Carolyn Pennypacker Riggs, our logos are by Kenesha Sneed, our associate producer is Destry Maria Sibley. It is hard to want to share your ideas and work with the world. . You're like oh, a place I can post a sandwich I eat every day. ... Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Play, Stitcher, Pocket Cast, PlayerFM, and CastBox. Lara: I think it's important just to try to be more aware when you're looking at photographs. Aminatou: Ann your sandwich content is always popping but also you don't need to put it on Instagram because you text it to me. A++. So it made it easy. That's the criteria. But look, this is my profession, a sick profession okay? And I'm like . I mean maybe it's like the multi-photo slideshow of having the next photo be like hello, here is my bank account from 2013 and this is where I -- you know what I mean? What else is going on? And we revisit our own notion of Shine Theory. . Ann: It is really just the trickery of capitalism for literally decades and decades and decades. Lara: Yeah, I think it's actually really challenging is what I'm finding out. I don't agree . Aminatou: This week I want to talk about scams. Ann: What to do with a personal camera essentially? We revisit our 2018 interview with then Senator, now VP-elect Harris. [Laughs] You know, they gave their presentations and they were like this person is like this and this person is like that. A podcast for long distance besties everywhere. Gus the Pug. Bedding & Bath 101. Lara: I remember this one boy who was clearly so smitten with Emilia Clarke I think from Game of Thrones. The Indignities of Being a Woman. Ann: Right, so slow down. Or like in this case now which parts of yourself to share with only this very lucrative close friends list? Link in bio to…” Are we getting the full context? Listen on Apple Podcasts | Stitcher | Overcast | Pocket Casts | Spotify. Ann: Yeah. Like my dark arts is marketing and PR. I'm like my life is literally a mess. There's not a single student in her class who isn't already making photos all the time. You don't have to contextualize anything. Aminatou: [Laughs] One day we're going to get it right. You don't have to explain really anything. We don't care." if you put up one speed bump to entry you'll get rid of most horrible people. Ann: How do you get them to see it that way? Aminatou: Yeah, you know? You may know her design work, her paintings, or her work in clay. . And it is not the same thing for me as just sharing with my friends about my life anymore. 2/1/19 - We watched both Fyre Festival documentaries. This is one of the reasons why I think fine art photography has tried so hard to separate itself from amateur photography and trying to be seen as different. And I would love to hear you talk a little bit more about the history of what we've been trained to take pictures of and want to share because that's not something that, as you point out, photography at this level is new. I don't even want to be Oprah. Ann: The number -- how fast the thumb flick goes. It's a very weird problem to have because I feel bad complaining about that, like so many people want to follow me. Lara: That does happen. We’re reading fiction, nonfiction, essays and anxiety-producing novels. One of the first easy to use amateur -- considered to be an amateur camera, so a camera that you could use if you were not like a scientist or, you know, some sort of specialist, the Kodak Brownie changed the culture from going to a portrait studio to get a photograph taken to something that you're all of a sudden able to do on your own. All go back from that, our early origins of using this as amateurs. Aminatou: You can find us many places on the Internet, on our website callyourgirlfriend.com, you can download the show anywhere you listen to your favs, or on Apple Podcasts where we would love it if you left us a review. And I was like wow, thank you for giving me that anxiety now because I didn't have it before. You know, these sorts of things. Beyond the quirks of those films we're left with qualms about the social media platforms that ensconce our lives, Instagram in particular. Aminatou: Yeah, but especially the kids. I'm too young to know about Woodstock. Aminatou: But we were promised this weird democracy, the Greek square where everybody's idea is important or . We're all participants in this culture. And it's more at the forefront in the Hulu documentary which one of the things that that documentary posits is that this wouldn't have been possible in a kind of pre-Instagram influencer era. Ann: Right, enough people had FOMO to hitchhike to Woodstock. Plus, how we think about what we post, and the accounts we love to follow. And they featured women because they wanted to show how easy it was to use. 1: Bad Feminist by. The instant besties later moved to opposite ends of the country, but since May 2014, they’ve kept in touch via “Call Your Girlfriend,” a podcast they record long-distance from their closets. My Instagram was always -- actually it was not always public but it's been public for a really long time and I always imagined that it was like you and Gina and seven other people. So if you get well-versed thinking critically about all the photographs around you not only is that going to make it easier for being a human today, because we are surrounded by photographs and have to deal with them, but I think it'll also make you a better photographer because you are thinking about how these things apply across contexts. Aminatou discusses travel, religion, finding ourselves and how we use coded language to find our people with Jedidiah Jenkins. Lara: Totally, yeah. I love how people are like ugh, in this era of positivity. I really don't like if I can sense that people want my lifestyle, I know that sounds dumb, but something that . We are an independent production. So I don't think that -- the fact that you are going through all of these stages is indicative of the fact that Instagram has changed. Plus, Aminatou's decision matrix and Ann's daily writing practice. Aminatou: @ifyouhigh. Aminatou: Thanks for coming to our TED talk. So I don't quite know. Whew. A planned tar sands pipeline through Northern Minnesota crosses tribal land and would disrupt waterways and wild rice cultivation. In this moment everyone's a photographer. Is it childish to call people Best Friends? Okay, not who she is but what in the photo is making you read chill? Ann: Yeah, it's interesting. But what I did not resolve after making that decision was I have now decided to make this a public kind of work platform frankly, like something that feels more akin to maybe how I would use Twitter and talk to other journalists. It's like a reaction to this early encouragement on the way to use a camera. And I think that that's a natural feeling, and at the same time I am not wanting to be any kind of barometer by which other people judge themselves just as I don't judge myself by what other people have going on when I'm my best self. But in a sense it is still kind of coming from the same place, right? 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